I wanted to share a story with you that just happened and something that’s really important to think about when you’re getting tips, advice and suggestions from people.
IMPORTANT NOTE: The comments are already taking a tone of sticking up for me, etc… And I REALLY appreciate it – but that’s not what I’m looking for. I just want you to know these people are out there. I’m never going to stop them from commenting on my photos, videos and tutorials. But I’ve had 25 years of practice in ignoring them. You haven’t… and I want to make sure you ignore them too.
To quickly bring you up to speed… I have a video on on social media for my Bird Photography Course. The video is below if you want to see it. In short, it shows my “through the camera” view of a wildlife encounter that happened really fast in front of me. There was no way to be ready for it, but I was able to lock on quickly and capture the action.
How was I able to capture some good action shots? Because of a few things. First, I had my camera settings where they needed to be already. Fast Shutter Speed (probably too fast, but there was a lot of light), right aperture and Auto ISO so I didn’t have to think about exposure. Next, I had the right Focus Area selected, so when I did lock on, the birds were in focus. Lastly, there’s no doubt there was luck involved. I didn’t see this situation coming, and I just happened to be in the right place at the right time. And I hope there’s not anyone out there that doesn’t realize luck is a BIG part of wildlife photography.
Anyway, this webinar and video had has hundreds of great comments from people who watched and were truly helped by it. But, in the typical “keyboard warrior” age we live in, there are always those people that feel they need to inject their comments and opinions, even though nobody asked them for it.
Spray and Pray?
One comment I get A LOT on it is “Ah… the old spray and pray method. There’s no skill involved there”. I get it over and over again, and I delete most of them because I simply don’t care what those people have to say. I know it’s not spray and pray and their definition of it is wrong. But every once in a while, I’ll reply and ask “How would you have shot it?”. 95% of the time, I never get an answer back, which is pretty typical when you challenge people online.
But recently I got this comment from some one:
Photography was so much more fun when you had to have skill. Now it’s all spray and pray. Everyone has the same images and they mean nothing.
– From: Guy who gives his negative opinion even though nobody asked for it
First, it was fun. A Ton of fun actually… I got to capture some really interesting photos and it was even fun to look through them. Next, I know it’s not spray and pray. And people who say this are 100% wrong. Spray and pray implies that you’re spraying your camera around haphazardly, with no skill or accuracy, and praying you get something.
I wasn’t spraying my camera all over the place, I was simply using a fast frame rate to capture multiple poses because I know there’s no way my eyes can follow this enough to pick the perfect moment. Do all cameras have this frame rate and do you need it? Not at all. But is sure does help sometimes, when you’re looking for various poses – and as long as you’re a good critique of your own photos you can delete the hundreds of junk photos quickly once you find a few good ones.
Lastly, there was no “praying” because my camera settings and those green boxes let me know I am getting sharp and in-focus photos. I’m familiar with my gear and have practiced enough, that I 100% know the photos would be sharp and in focus.
So I replied back with “How would you have shot it”. And here’s what “Guy who gives his negative opinion even though nobody asked for it” replied.
How would I of shot it? Well in my sixteen years as an environmental photographer, I would have shot it on film and maybe using manual focus. Eventually that changed to digital but still sometimes (not always) I would use manual focus and wait for the decisive moment. If I was not confident I would shoot in short bursts. Probably three shots continuous max and using a 600mm F4 at the widest aperture I could.
With a camera using the capabilities of the one in the video I would probably use the same autofocus setting, Shoot aperture priority and have the exposure compensation set to -2/3 and a minimum shutter speed 1/1000 or more and the lens set wide open if one of those lousy 400mm 5.6 lenses or 1/3 of a step down from max if a quality faster lens.
– From: Guy who never learned if you don’t have something nice to say, DON’T SAY IT!
So… Why Is This Bad?
His reply makes things worse. Not only is he a keyboard warrior who surfs around social media writing negative comments, but he’s also some one who has no business advising people on how to shoot.
SIDE NOTE: Why is it always a guy. I so rarely ever get women who write negative comments and are keyboard warriors. It’s always “that guy”. Please gentlemen out there… stop being that guy. Here’s a great rule of thumb on the internet – and in life. If you read something you don’t agree with, but they didn’t ask your opinion or for a critique… be quiet. Put your keyboard away and/or close your mouth. You weren’t asked and you have no business weighing in.
Now, on to why this is bad. To me, I’m not upset that he wrote to me. I’ve been doing this for over 20 years and have developed pretty thick skin. I won’t say it doesn’t bug me. But I do eventually brush it off pretty fast, because I’m confident in my skills. Does it annoy me? Sure, it would anyone so please don’t write “Matt, don’t let this annoy you”. It would annoy you if you read it every day. But Trust me, it doesn’t annoy me for long 🙂 And I’m not writing this because he annoyed me…
I’m writing this because “that guy” is among YOU – and he’s causing more issues for YOU – not me.
What does stick with me is the thought that this person probably belongs to a photo group or camera club of some sort, or has friends (though I’m not sure how many) that maybe he advises. If he feels it’s okay to write some person he doesn’t know on the internet to tell them how to do it, imagine what he feels about people he knows.
And the problem with this is that he may be advising people who are just starting out and don’t have a lot of confidence in photography just yet. Remember, giving advice and teaching is a SKILL. And not everyone has that skill. So this person could be a guy in your photography group advising people, when he is not qualified to do so. But because he’s probably so loud and confident in what he’s saying, people feel they should listen. Or they don’t listen and just talk about him behind his back.
And the worst part about it is his advice is bad. In some ways, he’s just flat out wrong.
Why Is He Wrong?
The statement that he would have shot it on film using manual focus should alert you that this person should not be giving advice. Now, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but his opinion would never produce the best photo.
First, film is prohibitively expensive to shoot fast action, low light wildlife photos. There’s a reason that today’s wildlife photography is jaw dropping, compared to what we would have seen 40 years ago. You didn’t have the frame rates, fast auto focusing, and low light performance to capture the photos that we see today. And that’s coming from some one who started in film. I know both film and digital, and I know what is better for wildlife photography.
Next, he says “I would have waited for the decisive moment”. Sorry but that’s a crock. There is no human that can follow that action in that video and decisively know what millisecond to press the shutter. As an example, no person would ever be able to watch this scene (see photo below) unfold in the 3 seconds it did, and know exactly when to press the shutter for this shot. I’d bet every penny I have that he would have missed it using his logic.
Finally, his settings. Aperture Priority will allow the camera to choose your shutter speed. With fast action photography, that is the worst thing possible because shutter speed is the most important component. You have to lock in your shutter speed and have control over it. And 1/1000th of a second would have not been enough shutter speed to freeze this action. So not only are his suggestions poor considering today’s tech, but they are wrong and would have produced a blurry photo. This isn’t an opinion, it’s a fact. 1/1000th of a second is not fast enough in this situation.
And the whole comment about a “lousy f/5.6 lenses” is just useless. I shoot a f/6.3 lens and I don’t think anyone can argue that my lens produces lousy results. Plus that whole 1/3 stop down from wide open is debunked. You do not buy a f/2.8 lens just to shoot it at f/4 because the quality is better.
His Final Comment
His final comment is where I’ll leave you. He wrote:
The problem with this is… You can literally hand that setup to anybody and even if they don’t understand how to use the camera they can put it on auto and fire away to get the same results. So my point is that photography was more enjoyable when everyone was not just buying the latest automated gear and getting the same automated result.
Here is where I believe he would actually do the BIGGEST disservice to the people he’s advising. He’s one of those guys that thinks photography should be hard and that “back in his day when he had to walk to school up hill both ways in the rain, blazing sun and snow all in one day” were the better times.
To me at least, his way and his thoughts sound stressful. It sounds like some one who followed his advice would always be wondering if they got the shot or had the right settings. That doesn’t sound fun – it sounds stressful. And if you’re stressed, you’re probably not enjoying yourself and probably not building a ton of confidence – not to mention probably not enjoying your time out in nature.
There’s a reason we have better wildlife photos today than ever in history. Because the camera now gets out of the way and people can concentrate on light, subject, creativity and the most important thing… getting that camera in front of something great. Photography used to be for the tech oriented people. Now, the creative person can thrive at it.
So, to what he said, YES YES YES!!! In fact, THANK YOU!!!… that is exactly what I hope to teach. You can literally hand that setup to anyone even if they don’t understand it, and they can indeed make a great photo. Who said you had to know all the technicals of a camera to have a good photo? Don’t today’s cameras leave room now for people that are creatively superior – and understand what makes a great photo, rather than understanding all the buttons dials and gadgets on the camera?
There is no definition that a great photo has to be taken by some one that knows all the ins and outs of the camera. A great photo can most certainly be taken by some one who knows how to put the camera in front of something great. Now, if you know both, even better – you have a leg up on everyone else around you.
Beware!
I’ve talked about this before in a podcast and I’ll continue to talk about it. Beware of who you take your advice from. While this person’s feelings on the topic may produce great photos, it’s not the advice you should be taking. There are 100 different ways to get a great photo. And as the saying goes, “Even a broken clock is right twice a day”. I’m not saying what he suggests won’t produce a good photo, but it certainly doesn’t set you up for success no matter what your skill level is.
I believe the best thing we can do for anyone starting in photography (or any hobby) is help them gain a little confidence. As a VERY amateur golfer, I can tell you that the times I feel confident in what I’m doing are the times I score the best. It’s when I get 100 thoughts going in my head while listening to people that are way more advanced than I am, that things start to go wrong. I can tell you that EVERY time some one has walked up to me on the driving range and given me unsolicited advice, they were ALWAYS some one that had no business doing it. Not once has this been proven wrong.
Confidence will help you get better, and encourage you to seek out more and more – and better and better. Trust me, this stuff is hard enough as it is. I promise you… you will NOT master wildlife photography and get bored in your lifetime. There are enough subjects, in enough places, and enough uncertainty in how they’ll act to keep you interested and help you create unique photos. The camera, shouldn’t be the thing that holds you back from it.
Thanks for stopping by and I hope this helps some of you. Enjoy!
I love teaching and photography... In that order. I feel that enjoying photography, and photo editing can get WAY too complicated. So my personal mission (and favorite thing to do), is to create education that simplifies the process of taking great photos, and how to edit them to get the results you’ve always wanted.
Agree 100%, enjoyed the read. Well said!!!!
Hi Matt
Great article as always and I agree 100%. However, I suggest you could take your philosophy even further. I take sports photographs and apply the same principles, so other genres may also benefit from your perspective.
Thanks again. Keep up the good work.
Agree 100% There are many people I see on social media and even in our local camera club that give ‘advice’ and it’s obvious they know not of what they speak. Some actually try to help, others intentionally badger people, possibly as an outlet over their own failures. As for the guy at our club, he’s genuinely trying but doesn’t have the experience or tact to help.
So glad you posted this!!!! I get a lot of “Keyboard Warriors” on some photo groups I belong to and I have found out they really don’t know what they are talking about in general. Myself, if I don’t like a photo I pass it by, if I really like a particular I always try to leave a more than generous comment about why I like of love the photo. That really seems to work best for me because it makes me feel good that I have also made someone else feel good. There are a million ways to take a photo and they are all good…..
By the way, I have watched and followed you for years and have learned so much from you. I am actually quite envious that you are so good at it!!!!! ?
Great explanation Matt. I like the way you handled this. I’ve been serious about photography for over 50 years and professionally for over 15 years and I’m still learning from you. Anyone who has to criticize another photographers work is obviously not a professional.
Matt, let me take this one step further. There are thousands of photography videos on YouTube by people giving advice and instruction. Most are not experienced professional photographers who know what they are talking about. Ten years ago, I wanted to venture into portrait photography. I thought YouTube videos would get me there. But after 2 years with lots of practice, my portrait photography was not improving, and I finally gave up. Why? Most videos were by amateurs, and many were giving contradictory, wrong and impractical advice. As a result, I was getting more confused and frustrated. A year later, I restarted my journey, but this time with a Masterclass from Joel Grimes. What a difference! Within a few months, my portraits were looking professional. I have since taken Masterclasses on retouching from Kristi Sherk, and on posing from Lindsay Adler. I now have professional studio equipment and do portraits professionally and confidently. Lesson learned! If you want to improve your photography skills, spend a little money, and learn from the professionals, like you, Matt. Don’t engage and follow the advice of no-names and “that guys” on social media platforms.
Something I should have thanked you for before – occasionally I get down and lose interest in photography (and lots of other fun things). All I need to do is watch one of your enthusiastic videos (on almost anything) and I’m excited and I want to get out there and shoot again. So thanks for being there.
Thank you for tackling this issue with force and insight, Matt! I will reference this post for a couple of SM groups I’m in and it will help some more folks.
Hi Matt,
Thank you for posting this. You’re doing a great service to not only veteran photographers like me who remember their film days, but also (and especially) to people who share our love of great imagery, nature, and the thrill of getting the shot–but who may be starting out or are not necessarily the most technically advanced.
In my 66 years, last Thursday was my best day as a photographer. I got a sharp shot of a mockingbird attacking a falcon that was too close to its nest. Minutes later, I got more great shots of two ducks fighting in a pond, water spraying everywhere. Yes, I took like 100 photos. And I kept only four. But it was far from “spray and pray.” Like you, I knew my camera. The settings were spot-on for what I anticipated shooting. And I’ve haunted the birds’ favorite locations for months.
If I had taken that guy’s advice, I would have failed, for all the reasons you listed. More importantly, as you stated, I would’ve been stressed, instead of having so much fun I was high-fiving myself.
Thank you again for all you do to make our hobby and passion so much more enjoyable.
A brilliant article by you and a conclusive set of comments based on true understanding of the topic.
Sadly, that sort of person exists in other worlds as well: audio, Hi-Fi, mobile phones, to name but a few.
Matt,
I’ve followed you for a long time and, as I’ve told you several times, You are the reason that I think I’ve improved with my wildlife Photography. As a former teacher myself I was impressed on your technique and attitude about teaching. I feel so proud that I have come to know you , both in person and through your tutorials and courses. Keep it up. One comment on “that guy”. His type is why I stopped looking at photo forums a long time ago. Too much puffery and self- aggrandizement. Thanks for all you do. By the way, your Bridge course woke me up to how useful it can be, especially in sorting and culling before doing and processing. The PS Summit 5 was really good. Neal
Thanks Neal!
Matt, I’ll take the liberty of telling you what you don’t want to hear: forget about this crackpot. I started taking pictures on film before you were born, and I have more camera equipment than is legal in most states — NONE of which makes me a good photographer. For me, it’s a f–king hobby and I love it for what it is: a great pastime. I’m very wary of advice from those who offer it, particularly when it is unsolicited. I’m just as happy learning from “real” photographers, and just as happy to learn from my mistakes. with that said, I enjoy immensely the advice you provide and will continue to sing your praises.
Hi Robert. I have forgotten about him. I posted this because most people following me are hobbyist/enthusiasts and they tend to take what some one suggests as gospel. A lot of people don’t have the confidence in what they’re doing. Truthfully, while he annoyed me a little at the time, this post wasn’t for me… and it wasn’t to shame him (I never mentioned his name). It was to help people realize that not everyone giving advice should be giving advice and this is a perfect example. Thanks! 🙂
Matt- I can’t agree with you more. I’ve been practicing photography since the 1960s and I’ve seen all sorts of trends, ideas and received a lot of advice. Photography knowledge use to be so simple before the internet. I read photography magazines, got inspired from National Geographic, and Life magazines. I read books and picked up and learned how to use a camera. And practiced with the camera until it was an extension of my eyes. I still do that. Film was expensive so mistakes were costly. Now, it’s a different world.Finding the golden nuggets of truth is out there but one has to dig for it. You have always given credible, time tested advice. I saw that first hand during a class you gave with Scott Kelby here in San Antonio, back in the day. I like your innovative approach to bird photography, seeing the action through the camera lens.
Sadly,even credible photographers sometimes give bad advice. One of the worst advice I was given happened during a seminar put on by the Photographic Society of America. Every speaker who talked about exposure kept saying to use the histogram and “expose to the right”. I quickly found out that it didn’t apply to all lighting situations after over exposing several images. I went back to what was working for me.
I only offer advice if asked and then with caution. Although I have a lot of experience with film I would never suggest to anyone to use it for any type of action photography. Particularly birds in flight which is very challenging even with the state of the arts cameras we have. Back in the 70s I shot a lot of sports photography for a newspaper with Tri-x and the keeper rate for a 36 roll of film was abysmal. Fifteen years ago I started using a digital camera and I have no desire to return to the good olde days and use film.
Keep up the good work Matt.
Brian
I’ve probably said this before in my comments but I just really enjoy who you are and what you have to say. I watch your videos even when I already know most of it because I enjoy your attitude. And yes, I still learn something too. So thank you for being you.
This “Guy…” strikes me as more about self aggrandizement than about providing advice or help to others – a trait all too often found online (and offline for that matter)
“Even a broken clock is right twice a day” – or three times if it’s at the right time during the hour time shift we just experienced here in the States. 🙂
Thanks Matt for doing what you do in the midst of the idiots, uhm, I mean naysayers. There was an article some while back from one of your fellow instructors about ‘ don’t be that guy’ when a person got a brand new computer and was proud of it and one of these keyboard warriors immediately started telling him how it was the wrong choice. As if he was *trying* to smash his excitement about the first new computer this guy had bought in 9 years. Why do people have to be so nasty and anti-everyone else having a good time? I wonder is it jealousy, a feeling of being smarter, pride (not the good kind), arrogance, or just plain misery loves company? Too bad “that guy” is abundant on the internet.
Positivity like yours helps smash the miserable environments they create. Thank you.
Hi
I loved those photos I would say to that guy Jealousy and Envy can be a bad thing
keep taking them lucky photos matt i think they are great I am 91 years old so I have heard just
about every thing nothing surprises me any more
I will never take advice from someone who says “would of” 🙂
Great article, well-written. Thanks!
Sadly it seems everyone is piling on him for the same reason which is not why I wrote this. That could have easily been me. My grammar and spelling are horrible and to be honest, I simply don’t care. If it’s a book or official article of any sort, that’s what editors are for. If it’s a social media, comment, blog or online post, it’s informal and I’ll forgive any grammatical errors. To me, this isn’t english class it’s photography. And being good at one has nothing to do with the other 🙂 Thanks.
Atta boy Matt! If I could submit 100 comments to counteract the doofuses I would. I enjoy your work and your instruction very much. Keep up the great work.
As a self confessed “buttons dials and gadgets” man I find the creative side a bit hit and miss! But basically I would have said the same about this guy.
Matt, this guy sounds like someone who has been at the top of his game and likes being there but is now challenged by his minions because of advanced cameras and software. No longer is he the only person in his circle getting nice images of wildlife. Others with less experience are doing as well, maybe even better than him…and he doesn’t like it. My guess is he’s an older curmudgeon that has nothing more to do than complain about the present and the future, because he is stuck in the past. And yes, you are correct to worry about those around him being influenced, but there is nothing you can do about it. Soon enough they will clue in on his game, and he will have to find more sycophants to bolster his weak ego.
As regards to the ladies out there in photography, you are right. You don’t see women jumping at a chance to dispute. I don’t believe we harbor the vicious, aggressive spirit that many men have. Most of us have spent our lives nurturing our families and now have the opportunity to nurture ourselves through nature photography. In the photographic world we may be competitive but not in a negative fashion. Most women simply want what is best for those around us and for the world in which we live.
Excellent article. I also really enjoyed your podcast on this topic.
Matt, I am a civilian photojournalist for the Air Force and my wife just retired from that job as well. We also enjoy taking wildlife photos in our spare time. This person is the perfect example of someone who bathes in elitism. I see them all the time. Their self-image of themselves as an “elite” photographer is threatened by new technology and ability of “other” people to also take good photographs. I’ve been taking photos in one form or another (not always professionally) since about 1975. Hence, I have shot film as well as processed and printed my own prints in a darkroom. While these things did take skill acquired through practice, they weren’t anything anyone else couldn’t do if they put in in a little time and effort. You are 100% right… modern cameras get out of your way so you can be creative however, that being said, I have a brand new Z8 that is a technological marvel but is requiring some serious study, practice and testing to completely understand the various settings and auto-focus modes and which to use when. I would challenge your, uh, contributor to let me hand him my camera with the settings I use and get a good photo. He might through sheer luck. Your Sony is the same…you still have to understand the camera and when to use which settings and modes, On top of this, there is practice and skill involved in post processing photos. I am sorry that this gentleman’s sense of self-worth is this easily shaken but he is, as you said, completely wrong.
I personally think what makes a “good” photograph starts with who is holding the camera, not what brand the camera is or their experience level. It is the photographer who is putting themselves out there and taking the picture and not being afraid to fail. Not all of my photos are share worthy by a long shot, but having 1 or 2 that stand out from a session is what makes the trip. I keep going back to the advice from the first course of yours that I took which is that if I like the photo/editing then that is all that matters and to ignore the pixel peepers, adding “that guy” to the list of who to ignore
…and this is why I follow you and respect your teachings.
When I read: “I would have waited for the decisive moment”, I had to laugh because I remembered Duane Michals, who said self-deprecatingly at a presentation of his arranged photos some years ago: “There again I missed the decisive moment”, referring to Henri Cartier-Bresson with his famous shots in the decisive moment of Paris life, some 100 years ago.
You are absolutely right when you say that this is really nonsense in this context (animal photography, especially bird photography). When you observe an interpersonal scene, you can wait for the “decisive moment”. But certainly not in a scene like the one on your video! In German, one says to comments like those of your “critic”: Klugscheißer! And that says it all.
Translated with http://www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
Well Said, Matt. I’m with you all the way and can confirm all you have said from my personal experience on your bird photography course.
Best regards,
Michael
Hi Matt, your comments regarding “Guy’s” comment are right on. Leaves me wondering if he still uses a Graflex. I started with b&w film in the late 50’s, and used a Graflex in high school in the 60’s. Now I use two Sony a1’s. Since I also shoot a lot of wildlife (mostly birds) there is no way that I could get today’s results with the equipment from 40 plus years ago. Also, especially from “experts” in photo contests, those who are new and learning photography need to take the comments of some of the experts with a grain of salt. I’ve seen some who really like to hear themselves talk and critique more than offer constructive feedback.
Thank you Matt for the encouraging advice. You remain an outstanding teacher of photography. Do you make mistakes – yes, of course, we all do! Admitting them, learning from them, and moving on are all part of the educational process. At 85, I am still learning and will do until the day I die!
My response to the know-it-all: The best business in the line of business is to have a business of your own. But if you don’t have a business of your own, make it your business to leave my business alone.
Thanks for this very good read, well done!
Matt, I think you hit the right note with your analysis of this issue.
I think most of us have experienced “That Guy”
Well. The first thing that might have alerted me was the misuse of language “How would I of shot it?”.
Matt, you are right on the money. It’s all about the subject you shoot. With today’s level of technology in cameras, you can get away with a lot, even if you didn’t think of checking all the camera settings before pressing the shutter button. If you go out to shoot birds and have all the right settings for that, and then an eagle sets down in front of you, do you not shoot it? Of course you do. Few people are handed a perfect setup. That’s why so many photographers want to learn Lightroom from you.
I’m an old guy and I knew many photographers who used twin lens Rollies and processed their own film and prints. They got great photos, but nothing they shot was ever moving. Keep preaching what you preach.
Sally-
Now I mean to be here.
I saw that question, too, and wondered if the guy is as careful with his camera work as he is with his language.
I know someone just like that in my camera club. He’s always telling you what to do and he is not a very good photographer. I don’t listen, but you’re right that others might. Interesting article.
I can tell you that even as a confident 50 year old starting to play golf, when I joined a golf club and didn’t play very well, some of the louder people that were around me influenced me… and not in a good way. You think because they’re loud and possibly better than you, that they must know what they’re talking about. Once I took lessons from some one I trusted I realized just how bad their advice was because they’re just not skilled at giving it.
Great article! Thank you for calling out “that guy”. I’ve had such an experience and not over the internet but in person. I’ve learned to smile and say ‘thanks’, because I don’t want to waste energy arguing.
This reminded me when ‘admonished’ over 50+ years ago after purchasing my Fujica ST801 Film Camera, my first, the ‘fancy’ light’ meter is dumb and won’t help you take good photos.
“Excuse me”, I said, “What’s technology for if not to improve what you enjoy, achieve better results than previously available, and still have a god time since you’re not wasting film in bad exposures?”
Well as turning 65 next week reminds me, the world is still full of jerks, those who think they know, and can do better, but the reality is, they don’t and can’t.
I’m still taking photos using a far superior camera than what I stated with in 1974. Love photography as much, if not more than so than ever before. Yep, don’t listen to “idiots” -plain and simple.
I’m an amateur who also has done film and digital. I had to laugh at that guys response. Film cameras never gave you pictures anywhere near digital cameras can. His settings were horrible just like you said. Thanks for your remarks and bringing all this up. Sometimes things need to be pointed out.
I agree with your comments and as you said I think it is especially problematic when “that guy” gives bad advice to people just starting out in photography. However, I do find myself oddly sympathetic with your commenter. I think the world and in particular technology is changing so fast that it is easy to feel you are getting left behind. It can be frustrating to feel you spent years working on skills that are not all that important anymore. I think of my 91 year old father who has come to consider the work “update” a dirty word because every time an update is pushed out to his computer he gets confused. We have made a lot of technological progress in recent years, but I feel like we still have to figure out better ways to help people adjust to the changes.
I think you hit the bull on this one Matt, I’m well over 70 and still enjoying learning about photography. Ed
THANK YOU!
It is so easy to say things on the internet when you don’t have to look a person in the eye. It has resulted in such a decline in civility. Thank- you for the article.
I got a chuckle from this.
I’m old enough to have started with a rangefinder Nikon with 3 lenses and a very neat telescoping thing for a viewfinder (after a Brownie, or some such). Eventually got an SLR…
So, feel confident enough to decide what to pay attention to. Some guys just have to pontificate as if to bolster their low self-esteem.
1/1000 vs 1/ 5000 sec. tells it all.
Don’t let the turkeys get you down. If they have nothing positive to say then don’t comment. Matt always has good advice but it is up to the viewer to try a different approach. As an educator, of high school, for over 40 years I can recognise a professional when I see one.
Wow, ‘that guy’ sure gets around! He bothers us up here in Canada too, Matt. Most of the time at camera meetings I don’t know what the heck he’s talking about and it’s intimidating. But in the last few years I have learned so much from you in your soft-spoken and un-rushed ways that my confidence is up, my photography gets better and better, and I’m getting immune to our ‘that guy’. Rest assured, Matt, that it was very helpful to have you point out the error(s) of his ways.
All I can say is “Amen” I couldn’t agree with you more.
Matt, it sounds like this is the same kind of guy that is still using a PC running DOS. Because that’s what he learned on and there is no reason to add a bunch of bells and whistles.
I have used the system you teach for wildlife photography. I have been an award winning photojournalist with 48 years of experience in most fields of photography.
Since using your system I have been able to capture wildlife photos that I had only dreamed of.
Thank you for sharing your experience with us.
Maybe photography isn’t supposed to be competitive. That sounds absolutely awful to me. Maybe the reason more people are into photography these days is not only because it’s more accessible but because it’s less toxic, more expressive and the creative opportunities are literally endless. Maybe there isn’t one right way of doing things. And maybe, just maybe, the only certain thing in life is change, so it’s important to be open to it.
There are people who “spray” their unwanted comments all over the Internet. Every time I see it, I say, “Get a life!”
(I guess they are politically disgusting, too.)
I I were u, I would just block/delete them. Responding is a waist of your time, Matt.
This blog post is wonderful and hilarious and while I definitely don’t agree with you that photography is not art, it’s craft (you broke my heart with that one! ?) I definitely agree with you on this one. Keep educatin’ Matt, it’s definitely your super power.
I believe it was Winston Churchill who once responded to volunteered advice with … “ thank you , I’ll give it all the attention it deserves “ Great way of saying ‘none’
Cogent. Well written. Excellent commentary. I really like your attitude and point of view. (From the guy who bought an expensive mirrorless camera and is having a BALL figuring out how to get great shots… and also takes nobody’s advice as gospel but rather, tries some stuff to see what works for me. )
“keyboard warrior” – I love it!
Matt;
Thank you for sharing your experience. It is sad to see the changes in the ways people interact these days have deteriorated to the extent they are. I have valued you and the manner in which you teach and share your knowledge for these past 20 years. Please do continue and never let small-minded people pull you down to their level. You are the Hawk!
Matt – I understand where you are coming from. Obviously I can not totally identify since I don’t make a living instructing and providing excellent training tutorials. What I want to mention is that over the past several years you have commented more and more about “that guy”. Sadly I don’t believe “those guys”, there are many, will be deterred. For example when, after you show a particular technique you note that there are a hundred different ways to get the same outcome so please don’t make a comment that “I do it this way”. It is unfortunate but it may be better to just ignore them. Commenting may even incentivize them since they get the attention they want.
Looking forward to your presentations at Virtual Summit 5.
Well done Matt. There is always that guy. They are there to be ignored.
Good stuff, Matt. The one I grew up with was “I know a guy…”. Always run in the opposite direction. It never ends well.
These types are everywhere. Before I retired, I was in academia. When I attended conferences, there was always at least one guy (yes, “guys”) who stood up after the presenter finished the speech and either contradicted him or added something else to show how much he knew. I’ve never understood that mentality.
Excellent rebuttal Matt K!
Well said, Matt.
I suppose spray and pray might yield an image or two every now and then, but one doesn’t sustain a long career like yours by using good equipment and “spray and pray”. Only a fool could think otherwise.
I have enjoyed my photography hobby for close to 40 years. I first “met” you when digital cameras were just taking off and I had just picked up my first DSLR (a Nikon back then). I “followed” many different photographers online, but today I follow only you. You are likable and I have a feeling that the social-media Matt is not any different than the at-home-with-the-family Matt.
Keep it up!
The guy is troll. I’m 75. I shot wildlife on film. He is wrong. That scene would have had may be 3 captures at most. Thank god for my D850 and long lens. I recently went head to head with a know it all that she need to upgrade her camera to get the pictures she wanted. The camera lens combo was iffy but it will work in certain conditions. He never even tried to help. She now understands the conditions and has made captures with her existing equipment thata re very nice. She just needs a real bright day! 🙂
He lost me in the very first line at “I would of (shot it on film)”. Anyone who doesn’t bother to learn that it is “would have”, the way you subsequently wrote it, has a tough hill to climb in getting me to listen to anything else he has to say.
All I can get from this post is that “That Guy” is jealous of all the great photographers out there. In the real world he is “the Bully” who really doesn’t know anything about photography. I grew up with film and am every so glad digital came along. I found you on YouTube and have learned a lot from your channel and I thank you for that. You can always learn something new from the pro photographers and the amateurs. Everyone has they own unique style of photography. We should never belittle anyone’s style and methods used to get the shot. I don’t shoot wildlife as I find it requires a lot of patience (something I don’t have), but I so enjoy looking at wildlife photos and envy those who have the patience.
Enjoy your day Matt and thanks for the post. I got a laugh at Manual Focus and film.
Well said. “That guy” has been on every forum I’ve ever participated in. Makes me appreciate the encouragers all the more.
Great rant on your part! As an old fart myself starting out in film way too long ago, then dismantling my darkroom and drifting away from hobby photography for a long period, it was the capabilities of early digital that got me back into it – because it makes photography more enjoyable than it ever was. It has to be fun, at least as an amateur hobby, or why do it! The latest capabilities just keep improving the tools, and as a result, increases the fun factor to do things you could never do before – what’s wrong with that! The only downside of digital burst shooting is all the frames you have to go through.
As for specific settings offered as “advice” – or when someone asks (only other photographers ever ask) what your settings were, I always find that amusing, (if not absurd) because you’re not going to be in the same situation, with the same subject, same lighting, the same gear, at the same time now, or in the future. You could also mention that your knowledge of bird behavior probably played a role in getting the shot, but luck really is the determining factor.
Wise words Matt, you hit the nail on the head about this guy.
I am all for listening to advice on photography from anyone, especially on YouTube, it can be from a seasoned pro or just a hobbyist that has something to give on their channel, everyone has there own take on photography and yes some of us do just wing it and get great results, the photography community are largely full of great people, advice, whether it be right or wrong is usually given with the best of intent, we all learn by our mistakes.
Manual focus… Lol… I wish
I used aperture priority on photographs in Africa, the Amazon river and other places…biggest mistake ever.
Picking the right moment, lol, lol, lol
I love challenging back, and yes you’re right, in most cases they very rarely respond back. Unless they’re stupid, stubborn or themselves wrongly informed and firmly believe in what they were told. This is not just in photography either, there’s a bunch of “them” (not the non binary sort, I’m referring to multiples of “that guy”) in all walks of life. They typically can’t resist temptation.
I often find on Facebook that this particular breed of person hardly ever share their own work for the world to see. Look for yourselves. Why? Because they most likely don’t want to be challenged or criticised…
Great response. Thank you for taking the time to provide a thoughtful and enlightening response. Much better than just dismissing his post as “crap”.
To be honest, I know his comment is “crap”. I’m not worried about me. I could have deleted it – I’ve deleted a 100 of the same “spray and pray” comment because I know they have no idea what they’re talking about. What he wrote will not change anything about how and what I shoot. But I do know that person lurks in many groups out there. And when challenged, like this person was, you see his original comment of being rude, has absolutely no merit to it and this person shouldn’t be commenting at all. As an advanced photographer I know it’s wrong… but people that are just starting out may actually take advice from some one like this and that’s where I hope to help. Thanks!
I really had a laugh reading this Matt, but also see the serious side. I’ve known so many “photographers” like this and they’re very fond of sharing their ideas and shoving in the odd quote from famous skilled photographers to spice up their (lack of) knowledge. I noticed the odd HCB phrase peeping in ?.
It’s true that modern cameras have all the bells and whistles but they are tools and in unskilled hands are as much use as a “Box Brownie”. I shoot mainly architectural images and detail shots of the same and I continually get the criticism “that’s easy because the buildings don’t move” ………sure !
As long as you keep sending out your stuff, I and many others will be there to enjoy it and maybe you could do an occasional “advice I’ve received from knowledgable photographers” article like this……I’ve enjoyed reading it.
There will unfortunately always be “that guy”. They feel left behind, no longer relevant and/or they need to be the most important person in the room. Best ignored or made an example of as you have here. A teaching moment. The thing is “that guy” will not be phased by this conversation about himself. I’ve learned to ignore them as much as I can.
So true… the “That guys” reading probably have no idea they’re “that guy”. Self awareness is a tough pill to swallow.
Couldn’t agree more and I see it in most groups I’ve ever been in. The “old pro” who thinks he knows it all and has been there and done it far better than me.
All I can say, and you’ve kind of already alluded to it, is you should try being a woman online! I swear, it feels like 90% of the male population is sitting in their basements just trying to find someone they resent so they can argue with them – and they believe women shouldn’t have voices. It’s pathetic. I can’t stand any of the photography-related Facebook pages for instance. (Omg, the Nikon FB pages!) Any post, any comment, will suddenly break out into an argument. Oh well, welcome to America I guess.
On a second note people should really peruse the social media of those they are considering taking advice from. I mean, there are some really terrible photos on the pages of many of the so-called advisors.
Hi Cindy… While I’m sure it’s trying at times to be a women because there are 100% people who feel they need to man-splain, it’s not just women. “That guy” appears on every single post I share on social media and I think I’m pretty okay at what I do, yet they some how find something wrong with it and feel the need to comment. And it’s not just America. Non-Americans are just as bad, just as rude, and sometimes worse because certain cultures are just different from us.
Lastly… I typically will go look at the photos and portfolios of people who write this stuff and you are correct. 99% of the time, I wouldn’t claim their best photo as my own. It’s just the way it is… keyboard warriors are rarely good at what they’re being a keyboard warrior over.
Absolutely right on target Matt. There not only are critiques offering bad advice, but there are so many “experts” producing short videos on “how to” capture or “how to “set up” that they conflict with one another. I would advise anyone wanting to improve their skills to follow a known & respected teacher like you.
I also would suggest that the best way to learn is to get out there and shoot, shoot, shoot.
Thanks for all your good advice over the years.
This is exactly why I purchase your courses and listen to YOUR advice. Years back I would read through photo magazines and read critiques of what looked like great photos to me. I actually stopped shooting for a while because I felt that I could not live up to such high standards. Then….You said something in a video that changed everything. You said “Procrastination stems from perfectionism”. I never looked back and I enjoy what I shoot and I don’t worry about what others think. Keep on going Matt!!!
You are so, so right. The camera is a tool and the best tools are those that make the job easier. I can only try to imagine what the work of early photographers would have been like if they had access to the digital world.
Good to hear from you Matt:
First, let me say that I like taking photographs because it is FUN and I can’t be bothered about people like “that guy.” I don’t have the latest and greatest gear and I am continuously learning how to make better use of my cameras and software.
Everyone who is serious about photography should be encouraged to create the best possible images within their current range of skills.
I agree with you that if advice is not sought, none should be offered.
Best of all Matt, you are having the last laugh! You are doing what you love, and you are very good at it. Oh, one other thing…how many followers and loyal readers does “that guy” have?
“That guy” has been in almost every workshop I have ever taken. Most of those workshops are taught by my friend, an excellent female nature photographer who also happens to be a great teacher. Like you, Matt, she has the ability to strip difficult concepts down to just the essentials so they are easy to understand and implement quickly. So many of “Those guys” are also incredibly chauvinistic, not all, but most!
If you think you have it bad, imagine being female with “that guy” “helping” you do your job. He is so very convinced that females cannot possibly understand the intricacies of their sophisticated equipment. His comments are dripping with condescension. In one workshop, “that guy” was pulling students aside and explaining to them why his way was so much better. My friend finally had to pull him aside and ask him to either stop trying to take over the class or to leave.
Also had to mention, I loved your bird photography course and learned a lot! I use your settings with my crummy 🙂 f/4.5 – 7.1 lens and have exponentially improved my birds in flight keeper ratio. I would love to attend one of your workshops. I know it would be educational and with your sense of humor, I’m sure it would be lots of fun. One of these days…
Well said!!! I love the advantages of digital over film! It’s important to encourage new photographers and guide them to great teachers like you. Thank you!!
Matt,
I know this type of ‘expert’. There is one in my photo club and you described his character perfectly. Amazingly, he never contributes photographs to any of the clubs sites, but he is quick to tell me how I should have shot one of mine. He is an ‘expert’ on eagles at our local spot (the one you visited in WA State), but never goes out there. I have finally been able to ignore him, as have many others. In short – Thanks! Appreciated all of your comments.
Your perspective has helped me more over the years than any camera settings you could give. I have found “that guy” lurks in camera clubs and workshops. One of my best photography skills is identifying and staying away from them.
As you said, giving advice and teaching is a skill. Part of that skill, which you have in spades, is not overwhelming the newbies. When I was new to digital photography camera clubs and “that guy” in workshops were my nemesis. I now have a pretty decent BS meter and it is good at ferreting out info that I don’t need or want.
I recently photographed my wife and dog at an agility trial. All that I got was no dog, blurry dog, or dog butt as she was going away from me. I have a long way to go but the settings your “that guy” gave would never get me there.
Great blog. I enjoy your take on things.
Thanks buddy. You are as opposite of “that guy” as I know. It was always a pleasure to be out shooting with you and I’m sure anyone you’re ever out with enjoys your company.
Matt, thank you for addressing this topic.
Is it kind, is it true, is it necessary?
These are three things to consider before giving any opinion or statement.
“That guy” did abysmally on all three counts.
Perfectly said!
He’s wrong because he is unskilled and uneducated! I have such high disdain for the “holier than thou, expert (in their own mind)” person. I met a person while I was on a photo trip that made sure we all understood he ALWAYS made sure he got it right in camera and never relied on post processing. Then I watched and listened to him ask thousands of questions about what the instructor was setting…..because he knew all of us novices just couldn’t get it right. Oh how I reacted to him with my disdain!!!! [grrrrrrrr.. ?]. BTW – his photos were NO better than any of us had.
I’ve learned that my photography satisfies me and I think I’m pretty good…..but have learned to be a better processor and make my photos standout (at least to me). I am not an educator and have no desire to teach anyone what they “should” do. But, I will show them what I’m doing and tell them my settings just to share.
Good blog that you wrote……but, it did pi$$ ya’ off…. ????? and I truly enjoyed reading it! ??
Oh yeah… we’ve had all those guys in our photo groups. I can name 40 right off the top of my head 🙂
As for the photos… I didn’t publicly write about it but he did share his portfolio. They weren’t bad. But they were FAR from wonderful and honestly, as much as he preached unique photography, I found his photos to be VERY un-unique. Not bad… but definitely not the quality you’d expect from some one writing in telling us how it should be done.